91xr7
Junior Member
Posts: 51
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Post by 91xr7 on Nov 10, 2014 23:24:42 GMT -8
So i decided to shelf my other project for awhile. So i decided to try something else. yes i don't know how to leave well enough alone and leave this kind of stuff to the experts Components on hand: LM311 VDO temperature sensor (P/N: 801-005-001) (A NTC sensor) I would like to be able to turn on the circulation pump (like in my Shelved project) at about 85-90'C (the Sensor spec sheet says that's in the 60-50ohms) I set up a breadboard with a 2.5K potentiometer (to Vdd) used as the Temp sensor with a 10K ohm resistor (to Vcc) to create the voltage divider for +input of the LM311, using just the 2.5K pot on the -input of the LM311 (Wiper to the input, one leg to Vcc the other to Vdd?). seems to work okay, even thou the Pots are near the end of their travel to get to the 60-50ohm range. Questions 1) Now the sender itself is also hooked to the coolant temperature gauge so i'm wondering how that will effect the whole process? 2) Since the range i want the pump to be turned on is when the Temp sensor is in the 200-0 ohm range, what will it take to have the turn on adjustment be set for that area? would Just a say 200ohm pot would be okay? Site i used to reference in making this circuit, but right not i'm running 12volts on everything since there is no 5V sensor in my project, and the Lm311 can handle up to 30Volts? Thank You
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Post by Gary Lecomte on Nov 11, 2014 13:02:46 GMT -8
I can't help you with a suitable drawing, until I get back home. Either the 5 volts or 12 volts is OK Most Important: is your Reference supply voltage, MUST BE STABLE. (Regulated)
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91xr7
Junior Member
Posts: 51
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Post by 91xr7 on Nov 12, 2014 11:19:11 GMT -8
I can't help you with a suitable drawing, until I get back home. Either the 5 volts or 12 volts is OK Most Important: is your Reference supply voltage, MUST BE STABLE. (Regulated) Yah aren't you suppose to be enjoying being down under in the middle of their spring/early summer(?) ?? When we are now starting to freeze our arses off up here But I do have a 7809 voltage regulator that I may run the LM311 from, just it can have a stable constant voltage itself, I could run the reference off of it too. But should use it for the sensor voltage divider too? The gauge the sender is also connected too it a coil based sensor so it has the Sensor terminal, ground terminal and positive terminal.
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Post by Gary Lecomte on Nov 12, 2014 13:21:36 GMT -8
In Southern Australia Now, (Victoria Region) Not very warm. Saw about 1000 "Fairy Penguins" Last Night. They are only about 10 to 12 Inches Tall.
No Need to Regulate the Supply Voltage. ONLY the Reference Voltage.
12 Volt Supply to 9 Volts is a Bit Close for Stable Regulation. But as long as it doesn't go below the 12, it should be OK.
Definitely you need a Voltage Divider on your NTC Thermister to set the correct reference point!
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91xr7
Junior Member
Posts: 51
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Post by 91xr7 on Nov 21, 2014 22:54:42 GMT -8
No Need to Regulate the Supply Voltage. ONLY the Reference Voltage. 12 Volt Supply to 9 Volts is a Bit Close for Stable Regulation. But as long as it doesn't go below the 12, it should be OK. Definitely you need a Voltage Divider on your NTC Thermistor to set the correct reference point! Well i have determined that because of the coils within the Gauge itself, that circuit i'm going to be taping into is a Voltage Divider itself. (Had it all setup on the bench (AKA dining table:) )) So by you, i just need a voltage regulator on the Reference side. And since in the car itself the voltage should be 13.4-14.4Volts when running so the 9 volt regulator should be find. Just need to determine on how to make the reference side easier to adjust. I'm thinking, if i can find it, a multi-turn 1K potentiometer on the low (ground) side, just got to determine what the resister needs to be on the high (positive) side. With my Bench testing i was able to figure out that the signal wire would be about 1.53volts running at 12volts at the temperature i want this circuit to turn on at. I'm starting to regret not have a 0-15V power supply now thou. And to Qoute Gru from Despicable Me " Light bulb! " I have a Car battery charger that should easily hit 14+ volts
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Post by Gary Lecomte on Nov 22, 2014 12:54:14 GMT -8
A 5 Volt Regulator would be better.
And a Normal Pot with trim resistors on each side to get a reasonable adjustment range works good. Sorry, at this time I can't do a Drawing for you.
ALSO, Battery Chargers are NOT usually good DC Power.
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91xr7
Junior Member
Posts: 51
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Post by 91xr7 on Nov 25, 2014 14:49:12 GMT -8
A 5 Volt Regulator would be better. And a Normal Pot with trim resistors on each side to get a reasonable adjustment range works good. Sorry, at this time I can't do a Drawing for you. ALSO, Battery Chargers are NOT usually good DC Power. I've been thinking of this still and even messed with the circuit over the weekend a bit. these are the values that i got in voltage based on a set temperature resistance (point i want the pump to turn on) 11.5 Volt source = 1.53V 12.1 Volt Source = 1.96V 12.3 Volt Source = 1.98V 12.4 Volt Source = 2.0V 13.8 Volt Source = 2.23V 13.9 Volt Source = 2.25V 14.4 Volt source = 2.32V Since Regulating the gauge itself at this time and moment is in all honestly out of the question, would regulating the reference voltage be a good thing since there is a good swing in voltage here depending on the cars battery voltage. Also i was using a 12 Volt sealed battery for an alarm system as my power source along with the battery charger for getting up to the 14.4 Volts. I'm wondering if i should determine what is the ohm reading is of the gauge and use that value on the high side? This is the basic concept of the gauge in question
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Post by Gary Lecomte on Nov 27, 2014 6:04:34 GMT -8
Both My Computers were Destroyed Yesterday by a Power Outage and a Power Surge. Also a Power Bar and a TV were destroyed.
Going to Try to get a New Computer Today.
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91xr7
Junior Member
Posts: 51
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Post by 91xr7 on Nov 28, 2014 14:19:46 GMT -8
Both My Computers were Destroyed Yesterday by a Power Outage and a Power Surge. Also a Power Bar and a TV were destroyed. Going to Try to get a New Computer Today. Wow I'm sorry to head that! Just what you needed right after coming back from a decent trip overseas. I'm going to take it you had backups of the computers. Heck where you live where do go to to buy new computers and TVs and such?
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Post by Gary Lecomte on Nov 29, 2014 8:26:06 GMT -8
I'm Not Sure What Blew on both computer, but Both were dead. I think the Power supplies. One was the Old Win98 that I'm not worried about and the other was XP. Both Hard Drives on the XP Computer are OK.
I got a Newer, Windows 7 Computer from a store in Penticton. (a 1 our Drive away) It has a 500GB hard Drive. He Also Installed Both the 2 Hard drives from the XP on it, So No DATA was Lost.
Now the New Problem: A lot of my Older Software Won't Install or Run on it as it is now 64 instead of the older 32. Some of which I REALLY NEED.
DAM MICROSOFT and their plan to OBSOLETE Everything!
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Post by lamazoid on Nov 29, 2014 23:24:18 GMT -8
Yeah, dam micro$oft But window$ 7 is relatively good one, as XP was at its time.. Try to run applications in "compatibility mode", in 7 it really works and solves 99% problems with old apps.
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Post by Gary Lecomte on Nov 30, 2014 7:30:17 GMT -8
How do you get to Compatibility Mode?
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91xr7
Junior Member
Posts: 51
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Post by 91xr7 on Nov 30, 2014 18:33:56 GMT -8
I'm Not Sure What Blew on both computer, but Both were dead. I think the Power supplies. One was the Old Win98 that I'm not worried about and the other was XP. Both Hard Drives on the XP Computer are OK. I got a Newer, Windows 7 Computer from a store in Penticton. (a 1 our Drive away) It has a 500GB hard Drive. He Also Installed Both the 2 Hard drives from the XP on it, So No DATA was Lost. Now the New Problem: A lot of my Older Software Won't Install or Run on it as it is now 64 instead of the older 32. Some of which I REALLY NEED. DAM MICROSOFT and their plan to OBSOLETE Everything! depending on the computer (hardware wise), and if you have legal copies of both windows 7 and XP, you can do the whole dual boot thing? Also i thought compatability mode was only on certain versions of windows 7 (like Pro). Best of luck to you on getting back up and running in the computer side of things OH just thought of something, wonder what would happen if you setup the boot order so that the HDD that has XP on it was the first to load? Yes it'll may have a hissy fit about different hardware, but wonder if it'll even run?
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91xr7
Junior Member
Posts: 51
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Post by 91xr7 on Nov 30, 2014 18:55:02 GMT -8
The topic on hand now Comparator by 91XR7, on Flickr the circuit i have come up with so far, and seems to be working on the "bench" not to badly. May still adjust the hysteresis a bit more to get it spread out just a hint more. I forgot to mention/draw in the circuit diagram that there is a 100uf Cap to smooth out the power supply for the LM311. the 12-22 ohm resistor is to fine tune the gauge to read center when at operating temperature. And as it is, there is enough adjustment to compensate for the change, so i should be okay there.
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Post by Gary Lecomte on Nov 30, 2014 19:16:31 GMT -8
I Can't Edit your drawing because my old program won't work on this computer. But there is a Better way.
Also not sure Why you would use a 330 Ohm resistor & 200 Ohm Pot. (Low Resistance and considerable Current flow.)
Yes these computer were and are Both Legal. And Yes this new one is Windows 7 Pro.
But the old one is Now in the Recycle depot.
Hopefully I can find a Descent & Free Graphic Editor program.
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