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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2006 1:11:44 GMT -8
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Post by Gary Lecomte on May 9, 2006 5:06:37 GMT -8
No That will NOT Work.
Those plans are for the "Hydrostar" system and besides the fact that it couldn't even come close to producing enough hydrogen to run a motor.
The Schematic is also drawn Incorrect and does not function at all.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2008 14:58:53 GMT -8
Hi Gary and all, does this schematic look like it would work? After you E-mailed me you got my intrest in hydrogen working and found this. As I haven't worked on electronics in 20 years.I figured that you could tell me if it might work. Everything that I have built from your design has worked wonderful. www.keelynet.com/energy/waterfuel.htm |
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Post by Gary Lecomte on Mar 31, 2008 15:05:55 GMT -8
Hi Gary and all, does this schematic look like it would work? After you E-mailed me you got my intrest in hydrogen working and found this. As I haven't worked on electronics in 20 years.I figured that you could tell me if it might work. Everything that I have built from your design has worked wonderful. www.keelynet.com/energy/waterfuel.htmNO IT DEFINATELY Doesn't Work. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2008 8:36:19 GMT -8
The Hydrostar eletronic module has a lot of a errors. The only "thing" I found correct is that a tubes perform better that cells. but the 2 tubes waste an energy. Better have 6 small tubes(5 inch lon with 1inch diameter for outside and 3/4 for inside. Pulsed dc it is preffered over a "brute force" as amps do not flow constantly and preserve energy with low (max 500Hz) pulse. Any higher freq. will not produce more gas as the (plates/tubes) will not have anough time to react. It is about amps and not the voltage and freq of a pulses what will get you to make a decent amount of a gas, but will not be sufficient to run your car on a gas alone.
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rmeyn
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Post by rmeyn on Sept 9, 2008 7:37:46 GMT -8
Ok, Suppose one actually produces enough hydrogen gas to add to the fuel being burned by
the auto engine. Where is the energy gain that would result in boosted miles per gallon? It seems to me that the energy gained is offset by the energy lost by the alternator in providing the necessary current for electrolysis. If we could pump hydrogen out of the ground and add it to our fuel injection, we would have some energy gain. I suspect that the mileage gains that have been reported are an illusion. If I'm wrong, please show me the math and I will start a hydrogen producing project today!
rmeyn
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Post by Gary Lecomte on Sept 9, 2008 15:49:25 GMT -8
Ok, Suppose one actually produces enough hydrogen gas to add to the fuel being burned by the auto engine. Where is the energy gain that would result in boosted miles per gallon? It seems to me that the energy gained is offset by the energy lost by the alternator in providing the necessary current for electrolysis. If we could pump hydrogen out of the ground and add it to our fuel injection, we would have some energy gain. I suspect that the mileage gains that have been reported are an illusion. If I'm wrong, please show me the math and I will start a hydrogen producing project today! rmeyn rmeyn, The energy gain is mostly because of running the motor LEAN. And partly because they actually tune up the motor after installing this hydrogen crap. IF they tuned up the motor Before hand, they would have very little, If any Gain. Posted by photoman on Yesterday at 11:36am The only "thing" I found correct is that a tubes perform better that cells. but the 2 tubes waste an energy. Better have 6 small tubes(5 inch lon with 1inch diameter for outside and 3/4 for inside. Pulsed dc it is preffered over a "brute force" as amps do not flow constantly and preserve energy with low (max 500Hz) pulse. Any higher freq. will not produce more gas as the (plates/tubes) will not have anough time to react. It is about amps and not the voltage and freq of a pulses what will get you to make a decent amount of a gas, but will not be sufficient to run your car on a gas alone. Photoman, Tubes Do Not Produce any more gas than Plates, Assuming Area, Actual Average Current flow, Temperature and all else is equil. It just appears to produce more because the bubbles are confined to a small area. Actually Plates are Slightly better because of EQUIL Surface Areas. Assuming your Mosfet can Properly Switch the Square Wave without distortion, the Frequency can be really Anything and still obtain the same results. And there is no Resonance or Magic Frequency as some claim. But you are right, It is All About Amps. (Or More Correctly Watts.) |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2008 6:11:43 GMT -8
I do not understand what it is the fusse about "energy gain". Using hydrogen gas as additcive to gasoline will increase torque power of that engine. Whatever lose of a power from " harder working" alternator will be compensate by increase a torque power. Actually a gain. I know that using ac will decrease the mpg, but with hydrogen gas the mpg slightly increase and since using a water to increase a comfort it is free - I said that it is a gain.
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rmeyn
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Post by rmeyn on Sept 10, 2008 10:22:58 GMT -8
The fuss about energy gain is a little law called the 2nd law of thermodynamics. The energy it takes to hydrolize water will not be regained by recombining the hydrogen with oxygen in an engine. You cannot create more energy than you start with. Now, if as Gary says above ,that
the engine is tuned lean (hence uses less gas) and is adapted to burn hyrogen as an additive than MAYBE a net gain can be realized. The problem I have with all the internet hydrogen buzz is that it is sensational and most likely mis-leading.
rmeyn
Richard
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Post by Deleted on Sept 10, 2008 10:56:35 GMT -8
To tell you the truth - I have no idea about thermodynamics law , but I know that generator do increase a torque in engine and that compensate for loss of a power due to alternator and ac unit( I like to stay cool in my car). Even if I do not get better mpg - I will not ger worst.
Did I mention that water it is free??(for now). With pulsed dc some my not get more gas that with a "brute force" but yuo do not get a constant current drain.
There it is a lot of misinformation around on internet and many unscrupulus people are traying to take advantage of the fuel price sytuation. I would like to send a warning to everyone. Do not buy a plans -those should be free. The plans will give to you general idea, but in most cases will not work " out of box" - you have to experiment with.
It is a fun to work with electronics.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2008 10:42:42 GMT -8
Well.............I donno about that. I bought the plans and some kits that did not work very well. I consider them a wise investment. I got about a hundred pages of good education (if I could just spell that word) and a couple of kits that taught me alot, even if I did just throw them in the parts bin. Now, I have everything just about done and partially installed in my little buggy. Next week I'll start my testing phase. I have a reasonably well paying profession so I won't be trying to sell you anything. I'll post as I go. If it's good or bad you'll know. It will be hard to gain anything as my car already gets about 35 mpg.
I'm basically doing this for fun. O'course a pocket fulla leftover gas money would be OK :-)
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Post by Gary Lecomte on Sept 30, 2008 18:36:16 GMT -8
I Also Agree that Paying for any of these plans is a Total waste of money.
If you search the internet, 99% of the time you can find the same ones for free.
UPDATE
I have Recently Developed a NEW PWM Circuit, with a Current limit control.
I call it "Ultimate PWM"
Its Much More Efficient than ZeroFosselFuels design.
Some Basic Info for it is on my website, in the Projects/Hydrogen article.
UNFORTUNATELY, I am NOT prepared to release any real details of it at present, Mainly because I have already had Numerous requests from persons who want to manufacture it and sell it for profit.
And I am TOTALLY AGAINST THAT HAPPENING.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2008 4:01:46 GMT -8
I'll be looking forward to seeing that circiut. "Zero's" circuit works but seems to disipate more heat the more you turn down the HHO gen current. Which means also, probably the hotter your HHO gen gets, the hotter your controlling Mosfet gets, keeping the HHO gen current stablized. A different kind of thermal run-a-way.
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Post by Gary Lecomte on Oct 1, 2008 5:46:19 GMT -8
Yes, That is because he uses Current Foldback.
The Greater the Current Foldback, the Greater the Mosfet has to Increase in Resistance. This Higher Resistance equils Increased Voltage Drop which also equils HIGH WATTAGE Dissipation of the mosfet.
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